Ajehoti

Specialist
Nov 6, 2016
64
-15
0
West Palm Beach, FL
Welcome to the new N54 platform everyone, where a few cobbled together guides makes anyone an e-tuna! Who needs experience and a proven track record when you have bins with leaked intellectual property and guides?? I should start stocking up on used good condition engines, going to be quite the market for them down the road :laughing:




And just like that, another wild tuna appears!

I should start selling built motors too. Rod and piston motors for that 13+ AFR on pump gas and 20+ degrees of timing with 30+ psi of boost
 

langsbr

Captain
Apr 5, 2017
1,267
771
0
Ride
07 335i 6MT e90
People who can't pay for a quality tune sure aren't going to spend for a built motor. They will have to buy a stocker from me when I own them all.

I am amazed that you of all people would say that. I have been around too many platforms to mention and for some reason people would rather buy brand name hard parts ALL DAY LONG vs ANY money on tuning. I've seen 15K engine builds on everything from LS, 4G63, 2JZ (why build it, aren't they good for 1000HP stock??), 13B (to be fair, it will blow up no matter what), etc and in nearly EVERY case, when asked about tuning - "oh, I got me dat AEM/Motec and I'm gonna tune it myself."

A friend with brains took his stock GSR motor with a Drag turbo kit and Hondata to a reputable tuner about 4 hours away (mind you this was 15 years ago now) and made 100 whp more then any other similar setup in town, and was cleaning house on the street (yeah, roll racing, but whatevs) and it lasted infinitely longer than all the guys that had built motors but crap tunes.

I would argue that the tune/tuner is a more important part than the brand of pistons or rods. I would run some chinesium rods and a good tune before i ran Carillo rods with a junk tune.
 

langsbr

Captain
Apr 5, 2017
1,267
771
0
Ride
07 335i 6MT e90
There is also some mass criticism of people that are "tuning" now. The thing that makes this country great is that anyone can hang their shingle to be a tuner. The worst part of this country is that anyone can hang their shingle to be a "tuner". Those principles benefit the good tuners just as much as the bad. Everyone of the well respected tuners had to start somewhere, and had to learn somewhere. Some may have blown up their own cars, some may have blown up customers', some may have blown up friends' cars, some may have never blown anything up but left power on the table.

One of the absolutely most popular LS tuners in my state can make good power, and most of the redneck boys only care about an ET and trap. They don't pay attention to the fact that he puts the car into open loop all the time, so driveability is crap.
 

Jake@MHD

Major
Platinum Vendor
Nov 7, 2016
1,593
2,060
0
Philly
@langsbr hey if someone wants to spend $10k+ for a quality motor and not the extra $500 or whatever on the tune to have it done by someone proven, they are welcome to. Those are the same 6466 cars that will only run in the 150's at the 1/2 mile after spending all their money :). I've also been around many platforms, and I guess my experience has been vastly different than yours. I've seen hundreds upon hundreds of people pay for retunes after changing the most minor of mods to be on the safe side. New intake? tune. Catless downpipe? re-tune. Upgraded fmic and piping? re-tune. You pay a good N54 tuner once and you get free retunes for all that, we're already spoiled.

People take for granted that the n54 is speed density from the factory and has closed loop lambda control. Great, it takes a lot of the tedious work out of it for you. But built motor noise, stg 3 heads, larger cams, etc all have intricacies beyond the scope of a t00ning guide.

You are 100% right though, your tune is always your most important mod, so choose wisely.
 

phv628

Lurker
Nov 15, 2016
10
-8
0
USA
Ride
2009 335i xDrive
Welcome to the new N54 platform everyone, where a few cobbled together guides makes anyone an e-tuna! Who needs experience and a proven track record when you have bins with leaked intellectual property and guides?? I should start stocking up on used good condition engines, going to be quite the market for them down the road :laughing:




And just like that, another wild tuna appears!
Tuning guide has been shared for the last couple of years. Plenty of decent base maps available online for those wanting to self tune. JB4 bef are not locked either. I don't see the big deal with others offering tuning services when there's plenty to go around.
 
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ShocknAwe

Captain
Jan 24, 2018
1,491
1
737
0
Charleston, SC
Ride
N54/3 1er ///Mutt
Tuning guide has been shared for the last couple of years. Plenty of decent base maps available online for those wanting to self tune. JB4 bef are not locked either. I don't see the big deal with others offering tuning services when there's plenty to go around.

The problem is when the tuning services are offered without any reference to the skill and experience of the tuner. Just about anyone can do and charge money for it with no guarantee they actually know what they are doing.

It's one thing to make an aggressive map, it's another one entirely to make power safely.

I and the other more veteran members of the N54 world know who offers which, but newcomers don't and these sort of threads are predatory.
 
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phv628

Lurker
Nov 15, 2016
10
-8
0
USA
Ride
2009 335i xDrive
The problem is when the tuning services are offered without any reference to the skill and experience of the tuner. Just about anyone can do and charge money for it with no guarantee they actually know what they are doing.

It's one thing to make an aggressive map, it's another one entirely to make power safely.

I and the other more veteran members of the N54 world know who offers which, but newcomers don't and these sort of threads are predatory.
If you're putting in several hours of reviewing and customizing a tune that ultimately gives the client a safe and reliable tune, then this shouldn't be a problem. Most clients are chasing more power and with that comes a more aggressive tune. The tricky part is delivering a tune that provides that additional power but safely. There are plenty of documents floating around that allows the client to review their own logs, i.e. JB4 Logging Parameters and their meaning, and Interpreting MHD datalogs. It doesn't take much for anyone to know whether the tune they are running is safe or not.
 
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fmorelli

Lieutenant General
Staff member
Aug 11, 2017
3,748
3,592
0
57
Virginia
Ride
E89 Z4 35i, F10 535d
I think the above is a clean room description. I come from the software world. When writing compliers (that which takes a computer language code and turns it into an executable program), the compiler itself is software. There is far more "code" in the compiler dealing with exceptions (things that are wrong about the written program being compiled) than there is "code" which actually creates executable from that program.

Which is to say, it's about exceptions, not the happy path. I build guitars for a living. It's a craft. I believe most everything can be seen through the lens of craft. There is a saying, "the skill of a craftsman is seen in his ability to hide his mistakes." I learned how to repair guitars fixing the ones I built, or the ones I owned. Then I fixed friends guitars. Then I took a long sabbatical (almost a year) from my then main line of work, to study repair with an expert. I did the same when I learned to build instruments. Total "study/apprentice" type time rivals graduate work to a PhD. 10,000 hour rule? That was my bar for taking money from people and being entrusted with their instruments. Why? Because because most anybody can follow a happy path. It's when stuff goes sideways ... THAT is what one pays for.

Unfortunately most people do not have the kind of experience in their lives (or translated it) to what I've said. Rather it seems comes down to dollars and how good the story sounds on IG. My advice - pay money for grizzled expertise.

Filippo
 
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Panzerfaust

Lieutenant
Jul 3, 2018
637
438
0
Chicago
Ride
E92 335i
If you're putting in several hours of reviewing and customizing a tune that ultimately gives the client a safe and reliable tune, then this shouldn't be a problem. Most clients are chasing more power and with that comes a more aggressive tune. The tricky part is delivering a tune that provides that additional power but safely. There are plenty of documents floating around that allows the client to review their own logs, i.e. JB4 Logging Parameters and their meaning, and Interpreting MHD datalogs. It doesn't take much for anyone to know whether the tune they are running is safe or not.
But what happens when the person putting in those hours doesn't know what a safe tune is? Early on in Dean's tuning "career" for the N54 when he posted his first or second DIY tuning video, I commented on how people should be careful with him because he had a car accidentally hitting way higher boost than he expected - let alone what was safe - and he didn't know why (on FB he had a big LOL next to admitting it). When people said I was dumb and being a hater because of how strong his tunes were, I did more research and found out he had almost no experience with the N54 before making the video and pointed that out. Much like some of his blinded fans have done in this thread, they ignored it and dismissed the idea that his tunes themselves could be dangerous and that it was on the cars owners exclusively.

The thing is, we have a lot of new people coming to the platform. For some of them this is their first time around the tuning scene. They may not know they need to log, they may not know what a safe log looks like, they might just have a clueless tuner sending them files that make their car go faster and telling them everything is fine because they're a great tuner. Or if they do realize that something is wrong, then it's not the tuners fault when it is.

It might not take much to know if the tune you're running is safe, but it takes even less to take advantage of people. Whether or not the OP who really snowballed all this could've had his turbo fail anyway is besides the point imo - we as a community should look out for each other and not allow people who have no real knowledge of tuning (i.e. "learned" just by tweaking other's maps until they caused damage, and just don't to to that point any more) prey on people who aren't as knowledgeable as the people who've been around for a while. If his intentions were pure and he really wanted to teach everyone how to tune if they wanted (a goal I would support), he would've spent more time learning for himself first. The fact that he just has specific tunes for broadly different setups instead of actually custom maps for customers seems to support the idea that he's working based off of stolen intellectual property too (or applying what he learned from it to the openly available BMS maps - "I prefer to tune JB4 BEF"), otherwise why would a skilled tuner just throw one-size-fits-all maps up online and not offer individualized tuning? Instead, all of his free tunes seem to be born out of spite - he didn't like having to wait on tuners to respond so he decided to bump up numbers in others' maps that were available to him, and now he's threatening to do more if those tuners keep pointing out his flaws. That's not doing the community a service - that's petty-ass revenge.
 

BoostedE90

Specialist
Feb 5, 2018
79
-10
0
South East Texas
Ride
E90
None of you TuNaZ have a perfect record, Lots of pots calling the kettles black in here.
A0EA37D9-FBBA-4064-AD76-D8A784952DB0.jpeg


Aj deserves his 2nd chance.

Rfp is being a robin hood

Wedge trying to Debo the forums,
if you want to blame anyone, sue MHD for your IP Loss on your out dated maps.
 
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Rob09msport

Major
Oct 28, 2017
1,929
664
0
Monroe CT
Ride
09 335i msport le mans 18 x5
If you're putting in several hours of reviewing and customizing a tune that ultimately gives the client a safe and reliable tune, then this shouldn't be a problem. Most clients are chasing more power and with that comes a more aggressive tune. The tricky part is delivering a tune that provides that additional power but safely. There are plenty of documents floating around that allows the client to review their own logs, i.e. JB4 Logging Parameters and their meaning, and Interpreting MHD datalogs. It doesn't take much for anyone to know whether the tune they are running is safe or not.
The only prob is when they blow up logging cause it's way off. Or when wot is fine but their could be serious part throttle issues or just tilting sensor etc some things aren't so apparent right away. The tune has to be somewhere in the proper vicinity to begin with.
 

Torgus

Brigadier General
Nov 6, 2016
2,671
2,194
0
Boston
Ride
ACF 6466 E92 + METH
Aj deserves his 2nd chance.

WTF? The guy who made probably 1/4 million while he tried to learn how to tune the n54 on customer cars? No, he does not deserve a second chance. He knowingly was ripping people off left and right. How the fuck can people forget this?

I'm so happy I never let my cars be tuned by any of those hacks. Anyone who does not use one of the proven N54 tuners gets what they have coming. It's not like any of these new tuners can do anything that the others can't. Other than pop your block because of less experience, knowledge, and for some reason they seem to like to push past the safety point.
 
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BoostedE90

Specialist
Feb 5, 2018
79
-10
0
South East Texas
Ride
E90
WTF? The guy who made probably 1/4 million while he tried to learn how to tune the n54 on customer cars? No, he does not deserve a second chance. He knowing was ripping people off left and right. How the fuck can you people forget this?

I'm so happy I never let my cars be tuned by any of you hacks. Anyone who does not use one of the proven N54 tuners gets what they have coming. It's not like any of these new tuners can do anything that the others can't. Other than pop your block because of less experience, knowledge, and for some reason they like to push past the safety point.
I guess you should never get your 2nd chance for anything in life, duely noted.

So you’re mad because he might have made some good money while learning and still working..
I seriously doubt you can even gap your own spark plugs you tuna baby.

And look at y’all GROUP DISLIKING COMMENTS.

Think maybe Ajs been bashed by enough people?
I’ll bet a quarter of a million aj can tune a engine 1000 time better right now than you could try in your entire life, if you think even the “good” tuners have not ever blown engine up think again, I can provide a customer video of a 800whp fullybuilt lt1 car built and tuned by HHP blowing up a day after being out the shop.
 
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Torgus

Brigadier General
Nov 6, 2016
2,671
2,194
0
Boston
Ride
ACF 6466 E92 + METH
So you’re mad because he might have made some good money while learning and still working...
Why would I be mad? I'm not the fools who give money to no name tuners to try and save $50 bucks. I pay for quality tuning like I pay for quality parts. Don't try and play the game if you can't afford to.



I seriously doubt you can even gap your own spark plugs you tuna baby.
Based on exactly what gives you the idea I can't gap a plug? You know what happens when you assume right?

Tuna baby? I'm not even sure what that means but I am sure you are trying to use it as an insult, albeit poorly. You can always tell when someone is losing an argument because they are the 1st ones to hurl insults:
When the debate is lost - slander.jpg





I guess you should never get your 2nd chance for anything in life, duely noted.
It's duly noted, not duely noted. Duely is not a word in the English dictionary. I have only ever seen duely used by idiot rednecks on truck forums and even then it's dually because dual meaning two.

2nd chance in life? Yeah sure, if you make 1 mistake or two sure. AJ made the mistake hundreds of times purposefully misleading people and taking their money. That isn't called a mistake. It's called flat out lying and being dishonest. He didn't just do this once or twice and learn from his mistakes. He only corrected his actions after it was made public what he was doing iirc. People don't change, trust me on that one. This is not my 1st rodeo, the same I cannot say for you.

You don't get paid the same rate as a Master electrician when your are a journeyman. This is the same in basically every profession. You pay for the seasoned professional, not the child trying to copy the professionals. I'm all for On the Job Training, in certain professions. This is done under a 'Master' or teacher who reviews the work you have done and critiques it. You are shown the mistakes you have made before energizing the system(using the electrician analogy) by your employer and teacher.

What AJ did is not OJT. He basically skipped all the school work, never paid for college, never graduated, and then wanted to be paid like a college grad with years of OTJ experience. Only word I can think of what he did was criminal. Luckily for AJ it's small money and small claims court is a PITA.



"I’ll bet a quarter of a million aj can tune engine a 1000 time better right now than you could try in your entire life"

The chance of you being young and not owning 250k liquid is 99.99%. You also know nothing of what you speak of. I have tuned my own cars in the past. What AJ is doing is not brain surgery, in fact the N54 does so much for you and has built in protections. Probably why he has not blown up more engines. You are making assumptions like a child. Only people who back up AJ seems to be pimply faced youths on facebook. You should probably go back to your echo chamber. Or continue to make insane bets on something you literally know nothing about.
 
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BoostedE90

Specialist
Feb 5, 2018
79
-10
0
South East Texas
Ride
E90
It's duly noted, not duely noted. Duely is not a word in the English dictionary. I have only ever seen duely used by idiot rednecks on truck forums and even then it's dually because dual meaning two.

2nd chance in life? Yeah sure, if you make 1 mistake or two sure. AJ made the mistake hundreds of times purposefully misleading people and taking their money. That isn't called a mistake. It's called flat out lying and being dishonest. He didn't just do this once or twice and learn from his mistakes. He only corrected his actions after it was made public what he was doing iirc. People don't change, trust me on that one. This is not my 1st rodeo, the same I cannot say for you.

You don't get paid the same rate as a Master electrician when your are a journeyman. This is the same in basically every profession. You pay for the seasoned professional, not the child trying to copy the professionals. I'm all for On the Job Training, in certain professions. This is done under a 'Master' or teacher who reviews the work you have done and critiques it. You are shown the mistakes you have made before energizing the system(using the electrician analogy) by your employer and teacher.

What AJ did is not OJT. He basically skipped all the school work, never paid for college, never graduated, and then wanted to be paid like a college grad with years of OTJ experience. Only word I can think of what he did was criminal. Luckily for AJ it's small money and small claims court is a PITA.





The chance of you being young and not owning 250k liquid is 99.99%. You also know nothing of what you speak of. I have tuned my own cars in the past. What AJ is doing is not brain surgery, in fact the N54 does so much for you and has built in protections. Probably why he has not blown up more engines. You are making assumptions like a child. Only people who back up AJ seems to be pimply faced youths on facebook. You should probably go back to your echo chamber. Or continue to make insane bets on something you literally know nothing about.[/QUOTE]


WOAH sorry MR.PC grammar police EXCUSE my extra E..
Dont come knocking on my door you boston cuck ill spell however i please, this isnt your forum you wanna be authoritarian.
What shop installed that ST kit and those "quality" parts lol?

ironically the one from the well known racist hick city's attempts to compare another member to a redkneck based off a 1 letter typo lol????
Obviously if i said i would bet 250k over the INTERNET im not serious? but don't think you know me or my family, how many business's have you started and/or help ran for decade or longer?
literally all you're doing is bashing a guy who worked all day and night for people while self learning, he been paying for his mistakes by loosing his extra income, job/rep and probably many very good relationships that would have helped his future.
And youre basically saying just because you cant change others cant from the negative things they've done give me a break youre not a judge or jury, just some 38 year old with an opinion.
OH and trust you? who tf are you, what are you doing for this community other than kicking people when they down that did more positive than bad!
 
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